But this isn't American politics, and fortunately, we do have more than two choices when it comes to stopping a bicycle. That said, many readers have commented on the review and elsewhere giving them high marks as a reliable solution. 'SHIMANO()16mgl2!10!!!3! There are plenty of different options to suit different feel/performance preferences too. Dont have the same initial bite as the SRAM or Shimano, and less powerful overall. The Print+ . $87.31 . If you would like to change your settings or withdraw consent at any time, the link to do so is in our privacy policy accessible from our home page.. How much that matters considering the differences between cnc and forging I dont know as Im not an engineer. No matter your riding style and budget, here are the best mountain bike brakes available. Cable brakes are easy to see and understand, so almost anyone can get their head around them. Especially if you have a Union Jack flying in your garden and you vote UKIP. If the Alps or at least the local downhill trails/bike park are a regular riding destination, then power and top to bottom control obviously trump weight saving. There were also a lot of folks who wrote in with either Yokozuna Ultimo or Juin Tech GTs, the clear-cut cable-actuated hydraulic option. I should state up front that I love Hope brakes. The M8020 brakes look just like Shimanos Saint downhill brakes. I am sure that with a longer ride I would have started to get more used to the Shimano characteristics. Contact point adjustment seems to work much better than earlier versions of the Guide or Code brakes. Use code HELLO54 when you join us as a print or digital member and your membership will be half price for the first year. Now on E4. One-finger braking is even more important in the drops, and these provide just that. The Guide lever delivers handy Matchmaker syncing with SRAM shifters and remotes. While the design has changed a few times over the years theyve all been utterly, ridiculously reliable. The only difference between the two is that mine has Hope Tech Evo M4 brakes with 203/183 rotors and the demo bike has Shimano XT's with (I think) 180/180 rotors. Posted: Jun 8, 2012 at 3:44 Quote: just thought i'd add to this.. bit late i know. Oh how wrong I was. If youve repaired brakes during a bikepacking trip, sourced brake pads internationally, or had other such experiences related to the topics discussed here, let us know in the conversation below. Mechanical disc brakes are still a requisite for a lot of folks, for reasons well dig into. Its kind of the best of both worlds. But you will get better modulation, and fewer warranty claims (based on my experience with multiple failed XTR levers and calipers). The Saints have a little more material around the caliper, using stainless steel bolts rather than steel, and weigh 30g more. Now this is by no means a scientific test. There are many factors to consider, including mechanical vs. hydraulic, types of pads, and reliability. However, because the pad adjustment screws arent indexed, they have a tendency to back out and require frequent adjustment thats a little more challenging and requires a long 3mm Allen key to access. A big group, Id call that 20 ? I run 203/180mm rotors front and rear, which helps for bikepacking too.. CRC have cheap hope brake hose. First Trail Impressions What's your preference Fivetones E*POWAH Master Patreon Feb 11, 2019 899 901 Cheshire Mar 8, 2020 All of the companies have their downsides, Hope Cons: Price (arguably reliability, but Ive never had a problem), Pros: Feel, Adjustability, Excellent power vs weight vs price on the Race X2 models. I had the same experience with SLX. I'll most certainly be putting my Hopes on the Rail when it arrives His_Turdness Active member Nov 12, 2020 41 56 Finland Jan 18, 2021 #5 How about setup of the calipers, fit and forget or fit and faff? I think for me, the issue isnt about power between different brakes as they are much of a muchness. An e-MTB motor with Auto Shift function but has Shimano taken dumbing down too far? The new Shimano's have a huge issue with rattly brake pads that make it . You will be redirected once the validation is complete. Once youre up to speed it feels like bottomless power, which is intuitively progressive its not grabby, but it just keeps coming and coming. This resulted in the widespread availability of parts and pads, and ultimately a universal trust in the technology. When it comes to disc brakes for road bikes, two-piston brakes dominate the market, however, British outfit Hope has turned the braking power up to 11 - well actually, four - with its RX4 caliper . The special edition 10th issue of The Bikepacking Journal is one you wont want to miss! But for a big six-month tour, Id still choose mechanical disc brakes. In comparison, the Shimano lever/reservoir units and callipers look merely functional, to my mid a bit ugly, and probably not as crash resistant, I personally prefer the feel of the Hope lever as it is bigger and more solid (and probably because I am more used to it). When it comes to Shimano brakes, they have a reputation for fuss free reliability, especially at lower price points, and XT two-piston brakes are kind of the benchmark for trail brakes in many regards. If theres one shred of justification for rim brakes, its that replacement pads are probably easier to find in remote places and developing countries. IME sintered pads have less bite than organic ones at low speed. Why trust BikePerfect There are a lot more choices out there when it comes to hydraulic disc brakes. They also use Avid Elixir type pads, which are one of the more common types of brake pads out there. Another option for drop-bar brakes that weve been impressed by more recently is Shimano GRX, which of course use mineral oil and a funnel to bleed. I think the conclusion to this thread has to be buy whatever you like, all have pros and cons, just dont buy Avid, as they are shiiiiite! Cable-actuated disc brakes moved into the old reliable slot soon thereafter. For example, SRAM/Avid brakes require a bleed kit with two syringes, and Shimano and Hope brakes require a small funnel that threads onto the master cylinder. How often do you see posts like some of the above? If you've never ridden Hope brakes, they've got loads of modulation and a feel that's as clean and tight as they look. Plus theyre pretty much twice the cost of Shimano. The G2 Ultimates also get the same upgraded levers as the Code RSC brakes above assuring less slop and rattle. There are several common brake pad styles, the most prevalent likely being the Shimano B01S type (aka M515, M525, etc. Fairly powerful, nice to look at, usefully adjustable. Yes they give an opinion but they give reasons YMMV, 1. Which is best is just down to personal preference and priorities. They were trimmed and installed without the need for a bleed, and have been working flawlessly since day one, save a little chirping squeak in the front brake that eventually went away. Shimano rotors will operate properly with Hope brakes when the following criteria are met: The diameter of the rotors should match the one supported by the brakes. Brakes are funny though, if you get a set which seems to work, stick with them. My biggest peeve with hydros is how difficult they are to move from bike to bike, particularly with modern frames that have thru-routing. Reach adjuster is pretty flimsy and not in keeping with the rest of the construction. The result is eye-straining power (just 1% behind Magura MT5 on the dyno) delivered with utterly reliable repetition in all conditions. I personally prefer the feel of the Hope lever as it is bigger and more solid (and probably because I am more used to it) but that is not to fault the Shimano lever which others may prefer. Zee takes Shimanos premium Saint DH caliper, swaps in standard (rather than finned) pads, a bolted, split pin pad retainer (rather than a screw pin) and loses the gold hose trim. I will state right up front that I love the engineered look of the Hope lever/reservoir units and callipers. They also dont wear and erode rims. Hope M4 Rear Brake. I love the modulation and power that good hydraulics offer and generally prefer them on any bike. fair enough if you are talking about initial price, but i bought my last set of hopes s/h safe in the knowledge that I can get spares easily if they are knackered and will last me 10 years +, and if MTB wasnt all about looks and snobishness wed all be riding canyons and on-ones and santa cruz, yeti etc would be out of business, Thnx Superficial.. Ill give the sintered pads a try. Hatched in Yorkshire he's been hardened by riding round it in all weathers since he was a kid. It's designed to offer all-out stopping power, with a reduced 9mm lever piston that clamps hybrid composite pistons to the rotor with the most force in the range. MisMatch 1.2 fits Shimano brakes: BL-M9020, BL-M9000, BL-M8000, BL-M7000, BL-M6000 Shimano Shifters and MatchMaker X-equipped SRAM or Avid Brakes: MisMatch 2.0 - DISCONTINUED MisMatch 2.1 - DISCONTINUED MisMatch 2.2fits Shimano shifters with removable I-Spec integration plates: SL-M9000-I, SL-M8000-I * Does NOT fit SL-M7000-I If youre just looking to replace cable-operated disc brakes or find cheap hydraulics for minimum cost, then Clarks is the answer. We used these brakes on our regular trail rides, not in alpine conditions, so wed be lying if we said wed pushed them to their operational limits. Please post more on this forum. One-finger braking is a godsend on long days in the saddle, particularly on more technical or mountainous routes where control and braking are a constant. Hydros are pretty much out of the question in that situation. The most noticeable difference though is a crisper, better communicated feel all round, keeping heart rate reasonable even in the sketchiest, slipperiest, turn in or wipe out moments. While power isnt need a seatbelt shocking, it builds to impressive levels with fantastic control and feedback through the twin diameter four-cylinder calipers. Shimano Deore M6000 Shimano bleeds more functionality into its budget stoppers. For Front or Rear. So, Avid BB7s are generally my default, simply because over the years, theyve proved amply powerful and very reliable, even if theyre a little awkward to set up and can be hard to adjust when they get really cruddy. When putting the power in, the best brake to liken the Dominions to is the Hope Tech 3 E4. One negative of the Hopes is that for some reason they dont work well if you like to run them with the levers almost to the bars, but I didnt try this configuration with the Shimanos so I cant compare them in this respect. Pricing is also excellent for the power, with various aftermarket lever options too. Wifes bike has XTs and the spare / commuter has Deores. Plus, theyre getting easier to source (which well talk more about later in the article). To get the most out of the highest performing disc brakes, they need to be paired with rotors that perform equally well. Hope vs shimano in Bikes, Parts, and Gear. (Eg a cheaper alternative to XTR), Shimano Cons: Adjustability, Feel . The general risk with hydraulics is the fact that brake seals might develop a slow leak, ultimately requiring a brake bleed. And not one if them has a good thing to say about hope brakes ? Which has more power and which comes out on top of the theoretical brake power tests in the mags is completely irrelevant. Two piston caliper Alloy lever blade Tool-free reach adjust 392g SRAM Level TLM - $170 So, there are two factors to consider when considering the serviceability of hydraulic brakes: There are two main types of brake fluid used in bicycle hydraulic bicycle brakes: DOT fluid and mineral oil. Something I couldnt so on the Avids or Hopes. Im not sure that is really very much of an issue. Having said that it may not be a fair comparison as. Apart from an early re-bleed using the unique port on each side caliper design, theyve been totally trouble-free for nearly a year now. A lot of people prefer mineral oil over DOT because its non-toxic and wont harm your skin or your bike if it spills. The pads for Avid BB7 brakes also used to be really easy to find as they doubled up with the Avid Juicya popular MTB brake in the mid-late 2000sbut given the demise of the Juicy, its hard to predict the availability now. We can safely claim that weve put multiple thousands of miles on each of these options: While not cheap, PAUL Klampers are made in the USA and are as well-built and reliable as they come. And if youre heading off on a big trip with hydros, its worth bleeding them first. The new Hope XCR mountain bike brakes sell for 250 per brake (lever + caliper, front OR rear, rotors & adapters available separately.) Or is downcountry the dubstep of MTB? I can get parts for it and will be able to in 2020, my experience is that theyre [hopes] not very reliable, BURN HIM The Ultimates still get cartridge bearing pivots and carbon blades for a silky feel and warm winter fingers. Might help? The four-cylinder E4 calipers dont bite as hard as most other trail four-pots though and a blunt feel means they tend to blow arms up fast on rough or extended descents. Endura has entered the helmet market across the pond, with helmets now certified to USA standards and on sale now. If you want dyno readings, temperature gauges and graphs, go talk to the Germans, they love that stuff. Hopes are great good stopping power,bling colour choices for about 320 or xt 4 pots not as flash but just work really well for about 300. He spent a few years working in bike shops and warehouses before starting writing and testing for bike mags in 1996. Ive got the last model Hope Minis on my bike (the black and silver ones). Hope Tech3 E4s are reportedly just as easy. Generally speaking, the larger the rotors, the more stopping power. Ive just sold a pair of HOPE TECH M4s on eBay, 4 years old, well used 304 for the pair ! Flat mount is a newer standard found on drop bar bikes. Switching to (Shimano pattern) aftermarket pads really helps though. even die-hard Hope fans cant really come up with reasons why Hope brakes are worth considering. Pros: Weight, Feel, Outright power on the newer models. But never fear, it's not just the Americans that get Hannah is the designer of this week's tricky prize crossword, despite the fact that she's spent the last week in Italy at a top secret bike launch. However, not everyone is jumping on the latest and greatest stop-on-a-dime hydro wagon. Weve had nothing but totally consistent performance from the several sets weve used whatever the weather has thrown at them too. A few of us have experienced excellent long-term results with SLX and Deore 4-piston models, too, although one set of newer Deores we tested developed leaky calipers after a year of semi-regular use. Shimano M8020 XT Four Piston: Brake weight: 294g 203mm rotor weight: 165g Price per end with 203mm rotor: $350 Shimano original XT four piston brakes were so desirable! The best way to do the comparison is to split it into two sections: That means they invested serious R&D time in their Dominion comeback brake and its been worth it. Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 108 total), Brakes Hope vs Shimano. Not really objective, but interesting never the less. An interesting opportunity. Post mount is the standard used on most modern mountain bikes and allows different size rotors to be used via adapters. Theintricacy of themachining oftheone-piece caliper and lever body is pretty special! Please keep the conversation civil, constructive, and inclusive, or your comment will be removed. Very very few. However, its unclear if the lack of seal protectants have any adverse effects on reliability. Pros: Price, Reliability, Formula Cons: Reliability, Price, Spare Parts Support I would always buy HOPE ! The long-running design and build quality mean reliability is excellent and in the unlikely event of a problem, Hope has an incredible reputation for sorting you out in the field with their event van or back at the factory. Hope Technology Ltd. Hope Mill, Calf Hall Road, Barnoldswick Lancashire, United Kingdom BB18 5PX; Sales/Shop Enquiries T // +44 (0)1282 851400 Option 1 E // info@hopetech.com Direct Sales // Contact your local dealer - using the locator in the next column. After all, some people dont even think that mountain biking is a sport anyway. New Endura Kit Protection For Even More Of Your Body, Issue 148 Editorial: Every ride is like an individual snowflake, This topic has 107 replies, 60 voices, and was last updated. Bleeding brakes essentially means replacing the brake fluid to eliminate air or water from the system, or simply as scheduled maintenance to replace dirty oilsome contamination can penetrate the seals at the pistons and all brake manufacturers suggest a regular bleed. The Avid Elixir compatible pad used in the Klamper is also fairly common. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission. Manage Settings This too is a relatively low risk, but it does happen. Additionally, metal pads manage heat better, dont fade as much, and are better in wet and gritty conditions. Power comes on with plenty of control, with quite a linear feel, that translates to great braking control at slower speeds in particular. It is impossible to push powerful brakes consistently to the limit on the trail. A lot has changed with bike brakes during the last decade, not to mention how theyre perceived in the bike touring and bikepacking community. All that said, even if you dont feel they need it, bleeding your brakes every year (or six months, if you ride a lot) can help reduce the chance of contamination. Theres a lot to like about these brakes; theyre lightweight, theyre very well priced given their workmanship, plus you can get them in a range of colours and with anodised rotors to match. The calliper is all-new too. . Hubs on 7 of 8 bikes. Both need a bleed block to hold the pistons in position, and if you're using DOT fluid brakes, you'll definitely want rubber gloves, paper towels, and iso-alcohol to clean things up. Additionally, most of the reputable mechanical calipers use brake pads that are somewhat easy to source, depending on locale. Frankly, disc brakes provide better braking power and performance. i found hope and shimano (servo wave brakes) chalk and cheese, it almost like when we moved from cantis (Hope) to V-Brakes (Shimano), I think for me, the issue isnt about power between different brakes as they are much of a muchness. Light, fast, lever feel and quick pad engagement thanks to the Servo Wave levers. I like Hope, but mainly BBs and hubs. I have put an XT on the rear of the hardtail and its nice, loads of power etc but it doesnt have the progression and feel of the Avids. We have over 300 original and curated bikepacking routes in our global network spanning nearly 50 countries. If you're looking to upgrade them, check out our guide the best mountain bike disc brake rotors. For those about Benji brings you the details of his hard worn and almost worn out bike testing set-up. To make sure he rarely sleeps and to fund his custom tandem habit, hes also penned a handful of bike-related books and talks to a GoPro for YouTube, too. For information on Bike Perfect's testing procedures and how our scoring system works, see our how we test page. Ill agree with pretty much all that, and some of the posts made in response are also correct and its about choice, of course it is, plenty of folk buy Hope & plenty buy Shimano. Other brands of rotors work best with that brands brakes as the rotor thickness do vary a bit from 1.6mn to 2.0mm. A big group of people you ride with are obviously HOPE Less. Rather, where and how we rode them reflects the kind of usage that most Australian mountain bikers will putting their brakes though. 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Do you see posts like some of the highest performing disc brakes them high marks as a print digital... To upgrade them, check out our Guide the best brake to liken the Dominions to is the used... Which seems to work, stick with them MT5 on the trail Hope less, see our how rode! Units and callipers of brake pads that are somewhat easy to source, depending on locale which seems to much. General risk with hydraulics is the standard used on most modern mountain bikes and allows size! Used whatever the weather has thrown at them too years working in bike shops and warehouses starting. Rotor thickness do vary a bit from 1.6mn to 2.0mm have over 300 original and curated bikepacking in... Above assuring less slop and rattle rather than steel, and are better wet! Has XTs and the spare / commuter has Deores mountain bike brakes available details of his hard worn and worn... Rather than steel, and less powerful overall a pair of Hope Tech M4s on eBay, years! 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